RT @humourme101: @BenFPiercePhD @PeterDaszak @COVIDSelect 1/ Peter Daszak has been calculatingly deceitful in matters of consequence to the…
@tgof137 @DavidBahry @BenFPiercePhD @PeterDaszak @COVIDSelect Peter, established by Xiao Xiao in Nature 7June'21 that live raccoon dogs were at HSM. From the beginning it was a good bet live mammals were there. https://t.co/7UXnx6Rfps
@BenFPiercePhD @PeterDaszak @COVIDSelect 1/ Peter Daszak has been calculatingly deceitful in matters of consequence to the entire planet. 2/ Animals were NOT “crammed in the Huanan Market”, there were sparse animal stalls within a vast wholesale market, av
@tgof137 @BenFPiercePhD @PeterDaszak @COVIDSelect We've known about the raccoon dogs since June 2021, dude (https://t.co/kJs49yQxoM) Here's Chan & Ridley talking about it in "Viral" (published Nov 2021) https://t.co/h8g4ryIXUg
RT @dakekang: 23/Evidence later emerged showing that live wildlife was indeed sold at the market, such as this very thorough paper surveyin…
RT @dakekang: 23/Evidence later emerged showing that live wildlife was indeed sold at the market, such as this very thorough paper surveyin…
RT @dakekang: 23/Evidence later emerged showing that live wildlife was indeed sold at the market, such as this very thorough paper surveyin…
RT @dakekang: 23/Evidence later emerged showing that live wildlife was indeed sold at the market, such as this very thorough paper surveyin…
RT @dakekang: 23/Evidence later emerged showing that live wildlife was indeed sold at the market, such as this very thorough paper surveyin…
RT @dakekang: 23/Evidence later emerged showing that live wildlife was indeed sold at the market, such as this very thorough paper surveyin…
23/Evidence later emerged showing that live wildlife was indeed sold at the market, such as this very thorough paper surveying tens of thousands of specimen at the market from 2017 - 2019: https://t.co/X5tclGicmC
@gregpiper There were no bats or pangolins being sold any of the 17 wet markets in Wuhan, China from May 2017 through November 2019. This is documented in an Oxford University study of the 38 species being sold, published on June 7, 2021. https://t.co/t9fj
RT @mstandaert: Thread: It has been a year since this report came out and China's government has still not addressed sales of live wildlife…
Nobody disseminates false information quite like the CIA. https://t.co/M3otlMw9ip
@_everythingism @ChrisShaver64 @BexZex @stevemur @NIH @JeremyFarrar What was on sale https://t.co/s5NITOJYpT
@benthompson An average of <1 racoon dog was sold each day in the whole of Wuhan … i guess this is enough to keep the possibility of a market zoonosis alive …. but is it really though ? https://t.co/oT3YDPumLJ
@gtuckerkellogg @RicketRobin @mikeydoubled You are quite deliberately implying that that vast area was devoted to selling wild animals when you know full well that only very few stalls sold any (& those in tiny numbers) Xiao Xiao records that <1 l
@FairyCalvo @ban_epp_gofroc Anyway what I've tried to do is prioritize direct accounts, such as journalists who actually investigated firsthand. The lab doesn't enter into the picture in these accounts. What you do see is a lot of secrecy and coverup arou
No bats or pangolins were sold at the Wuhan markets. https://t.co/llAhJRa9w8 https://t.co/CQKdufGrlo
@BenFPiercePhD Ben you obviously favour a market origin. Xiao Xiao extensively documented the wildlife for sale in Wuhan’s markets in the period immediately preceding the pandemic. What do you see as the possible candidates for intermediate species ? h
@past_is_future Specifically which susceptible animals were sold at HSWM that you see as potential intermediate species ? Tha animals sold at Wuhan markets and the quantities of each sold per month are both well documented in Xiao Xiao https://t.co/oT3Y
@ChrisShaver64 @Ticklicker56 @gtuckerkellogg Again: Not like we have evidence that there were animals there that were cleared out without being tested. ...Oh wait, we do have evidence of that. https://t.co/g9iXnt59ro https://t.co/XdSjUHk0Wq https://t.co
@ChrisShaver64 @Ticklicker56 @gtuckerkellogg Your position is self-contradictory, and likely intentionally so in bad faith. You ask for evidence they culled an intermediate host. But if they did that, then the host wouldn't be around for testing to show i
@gtuckerkellogg @AtomsksSanakan @ChrisShaver64 You should read Xiao et al 2021 - https://t.co/8LR8zH8wNE; see excerpt 👇. There was no attempt to conceal illegal wildlife sales; it was openly being conducted. https://t.co/CFgCBR5bCp
@Ticklicker56 @ChrisShaver64 @gtuckerkellogg Just like all are SARS-CoV-2 infections are reported, such that CFR based on reported cases is equivalent to IFR. [/s] Even with what the paper notes, the 2022 paper ran into the problem noted with non-mammal
@AtomsksSanakan @ChrisShaver64 @gtuckerkellogg You need to read Xiao et al '20, which is where Worobey et al '22 obtained the specific data for HSM. Note that both papers share co-authorship via Chris Newman. https://t.co/8LR8zH8wNE
@Ticklicker56 @ChrisShaver64 @gtuckerkellogg You were already told what was pertinent from that tweet with respect to you, and it wasn't HIV-1. It was you persistently dodging the fact that animals were cleared from that location, as covered in the links
@Ticklicker56 @ChrisShaver64 @gtuckerkellogg Me linking would suggest I actually read them. The authors (and other experts in this topic) not reaching the same conclusions as you suggests the problem is with your reading, not everyone else's. https://t.c
@Ticklicker56 @ChrisShaver64 @gtuckerkellogg If you actually read the linked material, then you'd know it wasn't just for the reservoir species for ebolavirus, but also intermediate species. And there's a reason your crowd habitually dodges animals being
@ChrisShaver64 @hypoautonomic @gtuckerkellogg Your pathetic + disingenuous attempt to move the goalposts is noted. You're still dodging the actual point: We have evidence that there were animals there that were cleared out without being tested. https://
@hypoautonomic @ChrisShaver64 @gtuckerkellogg Not like we have evidence that there were animals there that were cleared out without being tested. ...Oh wait, we do have evidence of that. https://t.co/P1alNofX4D https://t.co/XdSjUHk0Wq https://t.co/LYvM63
@ChrisShaver64 @gtuckerkellogg You're not asking in good faith. https://t.co/fSZYw8Tgjx https://t.co/aZD180NAKm https://t.co/Ule2EmBGyd
@ban_epp_gofroc @TheEngineer2 Engineer2 has uncovered a lot things online but the journalist Michael Standaert actually went to Hubei and investigated in person. I'm not why people would dismiss what he's saying. I'd recommend reading this thread... https
@stuartjdneil @roadjull You'll need to forgive the non-expert lab leak conspiracists; they're not honestly interested in evidence. https://t.co/fSZYw8Tgjx https://t.co/aZD180NAKm https://t.co/mdmnJshbHG
@BexZex @_everythingism @WendyOrent See Table 1…here’s the link: https://t.co/vKxIg1GZ2J
@kellywind @VaughnMises @AtomsksSanakan @LeviTD @gadboit But Michael Worobey did look into this and he says the market wasn't being monitored like this. It should have been...but that also matches what it says in the Xiao report. Disease surveillance just
@kellywind @_everythingism @LeviTD @VaughnMises @gadboit No, you're trolling. No matter how many times points are explained to you, you'll just say whatever you deem necessary to reach your pre-determined lab leak conclusion. That includes pretending thing
@kellywind @_everythingism @LeviTD @VaughnMises @gadboit You wouldn't accept evidence or reality, even if you were shown it + had it explained to you multiple times. You're simply trolling. https://t.co/fSZYw8Tgjx https://t.co/aZD180NAKm https://t.co/WX
RT @mstandaert: Thread: It has been a year since this report came out and China's government has still not addressed sales of live wildlife…
@ban_epp_gofroc Michael Standaert has done the best investigative work on this -- I'd strongly recommend reading this thread to see how much coverup of the animal trade there was. https://t.co/2agNkffOL1
@kellywind @gadboit @LeviTD @PhilippMarkolin This thread by Michael Standaert is worth reading BTW -- talks about how he went to Hubei province after the outbreak and tried to investigate, along with some of the connections of the market owners to CCP elit
@kellywind @gadboit @LeviTD @PhilippMarkolin Months later, a report came out showing that in reality nearly 50,000 animals had been sold in Wuhan before the pandemic, including live mammals at HSM...and that ALL trade was illegal. https://t.co/4k8K4lRCzP
@Daderp1242389 @emilyakopp @flodebarre Only to be contradicted by a report released later that year that documented the sale of almost 50,000 animals in Wuhan at HSM and other markets in the 2.5 years before the pandemic, including many live mammals and sp
RT @_everythingism: @Corp_Raider99 @theresphysics @past_is_future We don't know of course but there's no shortage of species sold in Wuhan…
@Corp_Raider99 @theresphysics @past_is_future We don't know of course but there's no shortage of species sold in Wuhan that could have spread it to humans. Almost 50,000 animals illegally sold at markets there in the 2.5 years before the pandemic. https:/
@tgof137 @SCStreet @Ticklicker56 @stevenemassey @abhishek_s_1 @BiophysicsFL @nizzaneela @mbw61567742 @OrionJohnston @RobTownley6 @Biorealism @PatrickSSte @StevanBolton @gdemaneuf @NateSilver538 @natesilver @jbloom_lab Most of these delays were due to slow
@plantparadise7 @plantparadise7, appreciated your willingness to engage with counter views. Below a thread from journalist who worked in China laying out case for powerful interests keen on distracting form market source of SARS-COV2. https://t.co/d0sDk44s
@past_is_future @jonatanpallesen @whstancil Also, which susceptible animal hosts were present at that wet market? It couldn't have been bats or pangolins (neither of which were sold there): https://t.co/lmKx6w5Kia
@Biorealism @jt_kerwin @rho_my_god @past_is_future I meant to write "Xiao et al '21" - see: https://t.co/8LR8zH8wNE
With a new flood of ‘what a coincidence an outbreak in the same city as a lab’ worth noting several things firstly well developed thriving illegal live animal trade https://t.co/s5NITOJYpT
@mattwridley And yet you are wrong https://t.co/s5NITOJYpT
@JamieMetzl @60Minutes So basically you were lying ? https://t.co/s5NITOJYpT
@plantparadise7 Wet Markets in China: https://t.co/aHathM2S6T
@tgof137 Again: Linked references are in my blog. 10k: https://t.co/G9CW041rrw… 95 M fur alone: 皮兽数量… 9500 万 https://t.co/zbxBdnaKLe
@tgof137 Linked references are in my blog. 10k: https://t.co/HGmNKsd59F 95 M fur alone: 皮兽数量… 9500 万 https://t.co/zbxBdnaKLe
RT @mstandaert: Thread: It has been a year since this report came out and China's government has still not addressed sales of live wildlife…
RT @mstandaert: Thread: It has been a year since this report came out and China's government has still not addressed sales of live wildlife…
RT @greedwashing: @plantparadise7 All the attention upon lab leak distracts from animal origin from exploiting and selling wild animals at…
@plantparadise7 All the attention upon lab leak distracts from animal origin from exploiting and selling wild animals at industrial scale that China had said would stop doing. Here a good thread re this matter by journalist @mstandaer who spent 15 years in
@Ayjchan @john_bumblebee None of this should be a surprise because the CCP initially denied any evidence live mammals were sold at the Huanan Market, despite a report documenting the sale of nearly 50,000 animals in Wuhan. You can't trace something you say
@MJnanostretch @Ticklicker56 @PatrickSSte @harishseshadri2 @Dissenting2020 @jbkinney @gdemaneuf @Bryce_Nickels HSWM was not a teeming wildlife market. Live animals were sold there, but in tiny quantities 👇 while the SARS-susceptibilty of the few racoon do
@willPS21 @Jikkyleaks @SeanCos4 @Ayjchan @nytimes So the failure to identify the source isn't a great argument that it came from the lab. Instead it seems like you should be asking why the CCP failed to release this information, while at the same time shut
@Biorealism @Illegalemigran1 @Jim_Edwards @nytimes @nicholsonbaker8 @mbalter @zeynep @KatherineEban · The absence of bats at the Wuhan market is meaningless as bats are not immediate vector for the introduction of SARS-COV2 into Wuhan. https://t.co/WODq
@AmericaShaman @AmericanShaman Consider this tweet and others that follow. https://t.co/hN11DdNMHn
@Ahab87304506 @Science54900201 @Rebecca21951651 @NateSilver538 For example: check out this study, which claims that the "data" shows no pangolins at Wuhan. Yet the data is suspect on its face, because the pangolin trade has been criminalized and thus delib
@Rebecca21951651 @Science54900201 @NateSilver538 I'm sure next you'll cite this study, which is *also* invalid on its face for the same reason. They're taking data from a non-black market sources & applying it to the black market. https://t.co/4qOlPrDH
RT @yesbutwaitwhat: 😯
@DaveFernig @sophie_e_hill @ComputerWeekly @BylineTimes Not only has China not provided this data, they haven't explained why they haven't provided it as this thread explains. Many obvious paths of investigation were never followed publicly. https://t.co/
https://t.co/mqxmL79nHL The corresponding author, Zhao-min Zhou, was a police officer in national Forestry for 6 yrs, in charged of pangolin smuggling investigation, before joined CWNU. PhD studied bats in Kunming.
@XinWei57337546 The volume of wild animals is much smaller than, for example, southern China https://t.co/0Swl51sDIW
@zeynep @wanderer_jasnah @stephen_lagana @BrianRWasik It's been widely known since 7 June 2021 that an avg of 38 live Raccoon-dog were sold PER MONTH in Wuhan, China (all 4 wet markets combined). Xiao Xiao's study was published on that date, documenting th
The communication author of above TED, also the 1st author of this SR, went to the 'epicenter', the exact booth, repeatedly, with documentray close contacts with ppl and wildlife animals, after close contacts with bats, before UP started to arise. https:/
@WendyOrent @humblesci @BenFPiercePhD Why didn’t they evaluate the other markets like they did with HSM - particularly the Baishazhou Market which Xiao et al. documented was involved in “selling live, often wild animals” https://t.co/RNc8LZnc3J https://t.
@RealYeyoZa @BiophysicsFL Was any sampling done in the Baishazhou market? https://t.co/RNc8LZnc3J https://t.co/arE9mUpoLK
@BiophysicsFL @ydeigin @Quillette There were 17 wet markets in Wuhan between 2017-2019, so the odds (back of the envelope) of it originating in Wuhan would be 17/39,397 https://t.co/RNc8LZnc3J https://t.co/S7syrqF9OM
@historyinmemes Someone took animals from the Biolab in Wuhan and sold it at the market. 💵 https://t.co/PcOqA79s3c
@pafournier @Biorealism @BioTurboNick @AndrewNoymer A careful reading of Xiao etal 2021 affirms no mention is made of farmed Raccoon-dogs being sold in Wuhan wet markets during their study (ie, 31 months prior to Dec 2019). In fact, paper repeatedly indic
RT @mstandaert: Thread: It has been a year since this report came out and China's government has still not addressed sales of live wildlife…
@UnrollHelper @_everythingism @mbalter @threadreaderapp Ok. Actually had wanted the sub-thread, in response to your thread, by @_everythingism but seems that the app doesn't operate as I wanted. https://t.co/UcWvUg8YSu?
@Samuel_Gregson @antonioregalado @JeanFranoisBru8 @Ayjchan @flodebarre @zhihuachen @alchemytoday @mstandaert @JonPloug I think Michael Standaert actually did interview him right? This thread is one of the most informative on what happened. https://t.co/2a
RT @mstandaert: Back to Huanan + 3 and late 2019. There is of course this important report: https://t.co/bRmUaSFLiV A report that's never b…
@robredotruthe @BiophysicsFL @Biorealism @BallouxFrancois @DavidBahry Given your last response, it appears unlikely that a credible reply is forthcoming - so perhaps this hint will embolden you to reply? FYI, there were no live pangolin (or bats) sold in W
@R_H_Ebright You wouldn’t find this everywhere but Xiao Xiao carried out some important sampling at the Wuhan Wet Markets before the covid-19 problem. https://t.co/hjZrBZadE4 The viral vector by asymptomatic transmission solution also fits the timeline.
@BallouxFrancois @knowmiun @NanoHydraulic @dima_strakovsky @HistoryBoomer @jbloom_lab @jbkinney @babarlelephant It was a relatively small part of a huge market. But everything points to the animal trade in Wuhan being significant -- nearly 50,000 animals i
@RottenInDenmark Meanwhile, the illegal & corrupt wet market has been covered up, pretty thoroughly https://t.co/F0FaFHRFRm
@PsyIsNonlinear @whstancil One of the few reporters who looked into it uncovered connections between the market owners in Wuhan and wealthy elites in China -- even with the Crown Casino money laundering scandal in Australia. https://t.co/2agNkffOL1
RT @angie_rasmussen: Don't believe me? Well, this paper from last summer proves it. Xiao et al documented live animal sales through Decembe…
@stewak2 Michael Standaert made an entire thread on the same issues as well https://t.co/7qMYG9ZakZ
@whstancil More like a thousand per *month*, across *all* markets in Wuhan, the vast majority not susceptible to COVID "Across all 17 shops, vendors reported total sales of 36,295...averaging 1170.81 individuals per month" https://t.co/QolAewMSXK
@abhishek_s_1 @Graybea71861266 @whstancil Its doubtful Stancil has any genuine interest in the willd animals being sold in Wuhan markets in 2019 , particularly in regard to mammals but , on the offchance 👇 (and besides, someone else might read it) https:/
@Ayjchan @mstandaert is a reporter with a deep knowledge of the wildlife trade in Wuhan and in China. He might offer an interesting perspective. If I understand correctly, the trade was/is important to both rich-powerful players on the top, and to poor-rur